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what type of light for video?Hi,
What type of light is best for video...I'm using 8mm. Regular incandescent are too orange, and fluorescent are too green. I've seen fluorescent grow lights and aquarium lights that are more pink than blue, so would they be any better or more orange like the incandescent? I'm using a Sony DCR TRV350 which appears to be only automatic white balance with no manual control, if that has anything to do with it. Thanks, David <D*@nomail.com> wrote ...
> What type of light is best for video...I'm using 8mm. Or maybe your camcorder is broken if it isn't capable of> Regular incandescent are too orange, and > fluorescent are too green. I've seen fluorescent > grow lights and aquarium lights that are more pink > than blue, so would they be any better or more > orange like the incandescent? I'm using a Sony > DCR TRV350 which appears to be only automatic > white balance with no manual control, if that has > anything to do with it. auto white-balancing to incandescent (aka. "tungsten", @ 3200K). <D*@nomail.com> wrote in message
Show quoteHide quote news:lntiv2lgur17085i04ueamlv41tm4ougiv@4ax.com... You might try GE "Reveal" Halogen bulbs, they claim> Hi, > > What type of light is best for video...I'm using 8mm. > Regular incandescent are too orange, and > fluorescent are too green. I've seen fluorescent > grow lights and aquarium lights that are more pink > than blue, so would they be any better or more > orange like the incandescent? I'm using a Sony > DCR TRV350 which appears to be only automatic > white balance with no manual control, if that has > anything to do with it. > > Thanks, > David to be "Color Enhanced" "Full-Spectrum". Luck; Ken On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 11:39:30 -0500, "Ken Maltby" <kmal***@sbcglobal.net> If the camera is "full automatic" and can't even handle regular tungstenwrote: > You might try GE "Reveal" Halogen bulbs, they claim >to be "Color Enhanced" "Full-Spectrum". sources, these lamps could not work either. -m- -- Show quoteHide quoteOfficial website "Jonah's Quid" http://www.jonahsquids.co.uk On 3/15/2007, D*@nomail.com posted this:
Show quoteHide quote > Hi, I would be willing to bet (OK, maybe only a nickel) that your camcorder > > What type of light is best for video...I'm using 8mm. > Regular incandescent are too orange, and > fluorescent are too green. I've seen fluorescent > grow lights and aquarium lights that are more pink > than blue, so would they be any better or more > orange like the incandescent? I'm using a Sony > DCR TRV350 which appears to be only automatic > white balance with no manual control, if that has > anything to do with it. > > Thanks, > David has custom white balance, but I'm too lazy right now to download the manual and find out for myself. Although that's not called manual, it does give a comparable capability. -- Gene E. Bloch (Gino) letters617blochg3251 (replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom") "Gene E. Bloch" wrote ...
> I would be willing to bet (OK, maybe only a nickel) that your camcorder I have a Sony Digital 8 that *only* has automatic color balance. My Sony > has custom white balance, but I'm too lazy right now to download the > manual and find out for myself. > > Although that's not called manual, it does give a comparable capability. Mini-DV has adjustable white balance. For the original poster ... What kind of circumstances are you shootiing? What is the color of the subject? What is the color of the background? What kind of room? Daytime? Nighttime? Windows? Are the lightbulbs all the same type (mixed incandesant / flourescant?) Richard Amirault wrote:
Show quoteHide quote > "Gene E. Bloch" wrote ... Richard, when you say the camera has automatic white balance, what do >> I would be willing to bet (OK, maybe only a nickel) that your camcorder >> has custom white balance, but I'm too lazy right now to download the >> manual and find out for myself. >> >> Although that's not called manual, it does give a comparable capability. > > I have a Sony Digital 8 that *only* has automatic color balance. My Sony > Mini-DV has adjustable white balance. > > For the original poster ... What kind of circumstances are you shootiing? > What is the color of the subject? What is the color of the background? What > kind of room? Daytime? Nighttime? Windows? Are the lightbulbs all the same > type (mixed incandesant / flourescant?) > you mean? How does it balance it? How do you tell it what is white? And if it's automatic, how does it do it? Usually, every camera I've ever owned even the cheapest, let's you point to a white object and hit a button so it can adjust to that being white. Does your manual in the Sony Digital 8 explain how it can possible determine a white subject on it's own (automatically)? It might have settings for daylight, tungsten, florescent etc...I can understand that, but auto, how? AnthonyR. AnthonyR. wrote:
Show quoteHide quote > Richard Amirault wrote: Consumer grade cameras typically have an "Auto" setting. Meaning you >> "Gene E. Bloch" wrote ... >>> I would be willing to bet (OK, maybe only a nickel) that your >>> camcorder has custom white balance, but I'm too lazy right now to >>> download the manual and find out for myself. >>> >>> Although that's not called manual, it does give a comparable capability. >> >> I have a Sony Digital 8 that *only* has automatic color balance. My >> Sony Mini-DV has adjustable white balance. >> >> For the original poster ... What kind of circumstances are you >> shootiing? What is the color of the subject? What is the color of the >> background? What kind of room? Daytime? Nighttime? Windows? Are the >> lightbulbs all the same type (mixed incandesant / flourescant?) >> > > Richard, when you say the camera has automatic white balance, what do > you mean? How does it balance it? How do you tell it what is white? > And if it's automatic, how does it do it? > Usually, every camera I've ever owned even the cheapest, let's you point > to a white object and hit a button so it can adjust to that being white. simply point and shoot. It takes care of focus and attempts to make a guess on exposure and balance. I don't know how many of todays consumer camcorders have a manual white balance setting. They will have settings for various environments....Sports Mode, Sunset Mode, Incandescent Mode and such but a real pull our your while card and balance may be disappearing from the lower price units. > Does your manual in the Sony Digital 8 explain how it can possible I have an older Sony D8 unit that has no manual white balance, but does > determine a white subject on it's own (automatically)? > It might have settings for daylight, tungsten, florescent etc...I can > understand that, but auto, how? > have about half a dozen environment settings to go along with its general - lets make a guess - full auto. How does it do it? I read somewhere that it was elves inside the camera, but, what would they eat? Tape sometimes, but that can't be all the nourishing. AnthonyR. wrote:
> Richard, when you say the camera has automatic white balance, what do OK when you do it manually the camera has to store the data from> you mean? How does it balance it? How do you tell it what is white? > And if it's automatic, how does it do it? > Usually, every camera I've ever owned even the cheapest, let's you point > to a white object and hit a button so it can adjust to that being white. > > Does your manual in the Sony Digital 8 explain how it can possible > determine a white subject on it's own (automatically)? > It might have settings for daylight, tungsten, florescent etc...I can > understand that, but auto, how? > the "white" sample you give it. With Automatic balancing a factory standard white is stored in memory and the camera just references that instead of something supplied by the photographer/videographer. It doesn't do as well a job of compensating for specific lighting conditions, but it's a good first approximation. -- Regards, Fred Fred wrote:
Show quoteHide quote > AnthonyR. wrote: Hey RayS and Fred,> >> Richard, when you say the camera has automatic white balance, what do >> you mean? How does it balance it? How do you tell it what is white? >> And if it's automatic, how does it do it? >> Usually, every camera I've ever owned even the cheapest, let's you point >> to a white object and hit a button so it can adjust to that being white. >> >> Does your manual in the Sony Digital 8 explain how it can possible >> determine a white subject on it's own (automatically)? >> It might have settings for daylight, tungsten, florescent etc...I can >> understand that, but auto, how? >> > OK when you do it manually the camera has to store the data from > the "white" sample you give it. With Automatic balancing a factory > standard white is stored in memory and the camera just references that > instead of something supplied by the photographer/videographer. It doesn't > do as well a job of compensating for specific lighting conditions, but it's > a good first approximation. > Yes, of course, I didn't think they could just store a factory default white, sure, silly me. LOL Maybe it's set individually per camera at factory? Or just in firmware per model design, probably the later. Then when you adjust shooting modes, rainy day, beach, indoors etc... it makes adjustment for you, i see. I guess post recording white balance can also be made in editing software too, right? By adjusting something in the shot which is known to be white, like a t-shirt to white and having all the other levels automatically adjusted. But I guess this would require lots of rendering. AnthonyR. Also I suspect know that many people are becoming eco conscious and getting CFL in their homes, (compact florescent lighting) the indoor auto setting may no longer be correct. As CFL comes in all ranges of color temperatures from 2700k all the way up to daylight 7000k and many ranges in between. I personally prefer the lower 2700k CFL, that are the closest to warm tungsten lighting for indoors except my office room where I use the bright daylight (full spectrum) CFL bulbs. But then you can just set the mode to outdoors when recording in a room like that. Happy Easter and Passover everyone, AnthonyR. "Fred" wrote ...
> OK when you do it manually the camera has to store the data from That's not really possible. The camera can't "store" a reference> the "white" sample you give it. With Automatic balancing a factory > standard white is stored in memory and the camera just references that > instead of something supplied by the photographer/videographer. It > doesn't > do as well a job of compensating for specific lighting conditions, but > it's > a good first approximation. white because it depends on the ambient lighting reflecting back into the lens. That's not to say that several manufacturers haven't tried some sort of "auto-tracking white" scheme from time to time, but I've never seen one that actually works.
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"AnthonyR." <nospam@sorryspammers.com> wrote in How about the simple way? Find out the average color of the scene, news:46152706.3000301@sorryspammers.com: > Richard Amirault wrote: >> "Gene E. Bloch" wrote ... >>> I would be willing to bet (OK, maybe only a nickel) that your >>> camcorder has custom white balance, but I'm too lazy right now >>> to download the manual and find out for myself. >>> >>> Although that's not called manual, it does give a comparable >>> capability. >> >> I have a Sony Digital 8 that *only* has automatic color balance. >> My Sony Mini-DV has adjustable white balance. >> >> For the original poster ... What kind of circumstances are you >> shootiing? What is the color of the subject? What is the color of >> the background? What kind of room? Daytime? Nighttime? Windows? >> Are the lightbulbs all the same type (mixed incandesant / >> flourescant?) >> > > Richard, when you say the camera has automatic white balance, what > do you mean? How does it balance it? How do you tell it what is > white? And if it's automatic, how does it do it? > Usually, every camera I've ever owned even the cheapest, let's you > point to a white object and hit a button so it can adjust to that > being white. > > Does your manual in the Sony Digital 8 explain how it can possible > determine a white subject on it's own (automatically)? > It might have settings for daylight, tungsten, florescent etc...I > can understand that, but auto, how? > > AnthonyR. > assume that that average corresponds more or less to white - or grey, which is a dirty white :-) - and choose a balance that makes that average color look white. This amounts to adjusting the gain of two of the colors so that their average intensity equals that of the other color. Let us say, adjust the levels of red and blue to match that of green. -- Gene E. Bloch (Gino) ... letters617blochg3251 (replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom") Gene E. Bloch wrote:
Show quoteHide quote > "AnthonyR." <nospam@sorryspammers.com> wrote in Your method is too slow. Find the most white and the most dark and make > news:46152706.3000301@sorryspammers.com: > >> Richard Amirault wrote: >>> "Gene E. Bloch" wrote ... >>>> I would be willing to bet (OK, maybe only a nickel) that your >>>> camcorder has custom white balance, but I'm too lazy right now >>>> to download the manual and find out for myself. >>>> >>>> Although that's not called manual, it does give a comparable >>>> capability. >>> I have a Sony Digital 8 that *only* has automatic color balance. >>> My Sony Mini-DV has adjustable white balance. >>> >>> For the original poster ... What kind of circumstances are you >>> shootiing? What is the color of the subject? What is the color of >>> the background? What kind of room? Daytime? Nighttime? Windows? >>> Are the lightbulbs all the same type (mixed incandesant / >>> flourescant?) >>> >> Richard, when you say the camera has automatic white balance, what >> do you mean? How does it balance it? How do you tell it what is >> white? And if it's automatic, how does it do it? >> Usually, every camera I've ever owned even the cheapest, let's you >> point to a white object and hit a button so it can adjust to that >> being white. >> >> Does your manual in the Sony Digital 8 explain how it can possible >> determine a white subject on it's own (automatically)? >> It might have settings for daylight, tungsten, florescent etc...I >> can understand that, but auto, how? >> >> AnthonyR. >> > > How about the simple way? Find out the average color of the scene, > assume that that average corresponds more or less to white - or > grey, which is a dirty white :-) - and choose a balance that makes > that average color look white. > > This amounts to adjusting the gain of two of the colors so that > their average intensity equals that of the other color. Let us say, > adjust the levels of red and blue to match that of green. > them so and interpolate all other intensities between those ends. Rick Merrill <rick0.merrill@NOSPAM.gmail.com> wrote in
Show quoteHide quote news:XPudnT0hEcqRCorbnZ2dnUVZ_rmdnZ2d@comcast.com: Perhaps you could restate the above so that it makes sense, not > Gene E. Bloch wrote: >> "AnthonyR." <nospam@sorryspammers.com> wrote in >> news:46152706.3000301@sorryspammers.com: >> >>> Richard Amirault wrote: >>>> "Gene E. Bloch" wrote ... >>>>> I would be willing to bet (OK, maybe only a nickel) that your >>>>> camcorder has custom white balance, but I'm too lazy right now >>>>> to download the manual and find out for myself. >>>>> >>>>> Although that's not called manual, it does give a comparable >>>>> capability. >>>> I have a Sony Digital 8 that *only* has automatic color >>>> balance. My Sony Mini-DV has adjustable white balance. >>>> >>>> For the original poster ... What kind of circumstances are you >>>> shootiing? What is the color of the subject? What is the color >>>> of the background? What kind of room? Daytime? Nighttime? >>>> Windows? Are the lightbulbs all the same type (mixed >>>> incandesant / flourescant?) >>>> >>> Richard, when you say the camera has automatic white balance, >>> what do you mean? How does it balance it? How do you tell it >>> what is white? And if it's automatic, how does it do it? >>> Usually, every camera I've ever owned even the cheapest, let's >>> you point to a white object and hit a button so it can adjust to >>> that being white. >>> >>> Does your manual in the Sony Digital 8 explain how it can >>> possible determine a white subject on it's own (automatically)? >>> It might have settings for daylight, tungsten, florescent >>> etc...I can understand that, but auto, how? >>> >>> AnthonyR. >>> >> >> How about the simple way? Find out the average color of the >> scene, assume that that average corresponds more or less to white >> - or grey, which is a dirty white :-) - and choose a balance that >> makes that average color look white. >> >> This amounts to adjusting the gain of two of the colors so that >> their average intensity equals that of the other color. Let us >> say, adjust the levels of red and blue to match that of green. >> > > Your method is too slow. Find the most white and the most dark and > make them so and interpolate all other intensities between those > ends. forgetting that we're in the context of computing white balance... Since today's typical still camera can compute and display a complete histogram in real time (some cameras display three histograms, R, G, & B), and since the white balance has to be done only once per session (if so desired), I wonder where you got the idea that my idea is too slow. Also, the computation I described is just one extra step per pixel (incrementing a count in an array indexed on the digitized value), so it could indeed be continuous if desired, with no problem. It also has the advantage that it is logically correct. I don't think your proposed method is, but since it is so oddly phrased, I can't be sure what you're proposing. -- Gene E. Bloch (Gino) ... letters617blochg3251 (replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom") "AnthonyR."
> Richard, when you say the camera has automatic white balance, what do you I meant just what I said. There is NO option for color balance on this > mean? camera (Sony TRV-240) > How does it balance it? How do you tell it what is white? Hmmm ... How am I supposed to know that?> And if it's automatic, how does it do it? > Usually, every camera I've ever owned even the cheapest, let's you point Yes, I have cameras like that. THIS camera does NOT have that option.> to a white object and hit a button so it can adjust to that being white. > > Does your manual in the Sony Digital 8 explain how it can possible It has NO settings for ANYTHING in the color balance department.> determine a white subject on it's own (automatically)? > It might have settings for daylight, tungsten, florescent etc...I can > understand that, but auto, how? > I have footage where I re-aimed the camera during a continuous shoot from a person at a podium to an LCD projector screen and you can see the camera adjust the color balance after a second or two. PS. This camera is not a bare bones model. I have a manual focus ring (not mechanically coupled to the lens, but it works) and I have a jack for an external mic (which I use *often*)  
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