"Jerry G." <jerry***@hotmail.com> pí¹e v diskusním pøíspìvku
news:3a5drhF66l2itU3@uni-berlin.de...
> The only way to test capacitors is to use an ESR meter, or to substitute
> them.
>
> --
>
> Jerry G.
> ======
>
>
> "Zdenek Sojka" <xXzsoXjkaXx.***@seXznamX.cz> wrote in message
> news:d1js6h$1q0u$1@ns.felk.cvut.cz...
> Hello,
>
> can be these caps reason for my PC instability? Even on 1.85V is my Duron
> 1300 producing faults at Prime95...
>
> http://www.volny.cz/smatt/caps/
>
> MB is Abit KT7, VIA KT133.
>
> Thanks
> Zdenek Sojka
>
>
>

> Well, thats the reason why I am asking... testing the CPU in different
> PC would be a waste of time, as that cannot be 100% proof of bad MB.
> Also I dont have any chance to test if caps are good. If someone has
> seen caps like these not working, then that can be a reason...

> Hello,
>
> can be these caps reason for my PC instability? Even on 1.85V is my Duron
> 1300 producing faults at Prime95...
>
> http://www.volny.cz/smatt/caps/
>
> MB is Abit KT7, VIA KT133.
>
> Thanks
> Zdenek Sojka
>
>

"Dan" <prograde49NOSPAM@hotmail.com> píse v diskusním príspevku
news:3a5it5F67q1aoU1@individual.net...
> I had to replace a number of caps on the 2000 vintage MSI K7T PRO
> (MS-6330) that came with my gateway pc.  The quickest way to tell if
> they are bad is to check if the tops appear bulged (should be flat), or
> if there is electrolyte on the mobo surrounding them (looks a bit like
> oil).  They're fairly easy to replace if you know how to solder, if not
> don't even attempt it, especially with the thin, cramped traces on these
> mobos.  See http://www.badcaps.com/  A good source for the caps is
> digikey.com
>
> Dan
>
> Zdenek Sojka wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > can be these caps reason for my PC instability? Even on 1.85V is my
Duron
> > 1300 producing faults at Prime95...
> >
> > http://www.volny.cz/smatt/caps/
> >
> > MB is Abit KT7, VIA KT133.
> >
> > Thanks
> > Zdenek Sojka
> >
> >

> Aha, thanks, it seems that the photo P3180010.JPG exactly shows
> electrolyte has flown from capacitors.  Too bad news ;-(
> On the site is also a note about KT7 that it is one of the worst MBs...
> The 'kit' would cost about $30 and without chance of shipping ...
> anyway, changing only 10 caps would not be so expensive - I can buy
> it in my city. But if I did any mistake while soldering, the MB would
> go dead anyway. Nowadays, with SocketA MB prices at ~ $40 its a
> better way to buy a new one (after this fails totally, buy a new one)

>   It is not clear that the material is electrolyte.  When
> manufacturing these boards, a sticky substance is applied
> beneath capacitor so that vibration does not jar that
> electrolytic off motherboard during wave soldering.  Is that
> electrolyte or the glue?  They look similar.
>
> Zdenek Sojka wrote:
>
>>Aha, thanks, it seems that the photo P3180010.JPG exactly shows
>>electrolyte has flown from capacitors.  Too bad news ;-(
>>On the site is also a note about KT7 that it is one of the worst MBs...
>>The 'kit' would cost about $30 and without chance of shipping ...
>>anyway, changing only 10 caps would not be so expensive - I can buy
>>it in my city. But if I did any mistake while soldering, the MB would
>>go dead anyway. Nowadays, with SocketA MB prices at ~ $40 its a
>>better way to buy a new one (after this fails totally, buy a new one)

"Zdenek Sojka" <xXzsoXjkaXx.***@seXznamX.cz> wrote in message
news:d1js6h$1q0u$1@ns.felk.cvut.cz...
> Hello,
>
> can be these caps reason for my PC instability? Even on 1.85V is my
> Duron
> 1300 producing faults at Prime95...
>
> http://www.volny.cz/smatt/caps/
>
> MB is Abit KT7, VIA KT133.
>
> Thanks
> Zdenek Sojka
>
>

"Vanguard" <use_ReplyTo_header> píse v diskusním príspevku
news:1t-dnX_-a9DuAaDfRVn-pw@comcast.com...
> "Zdenek Sojka" <xXzsoXjkaXx.***@seXznamX.cz> wrote in message
> news:d1js6h$1q0u$1@ns.felk.cvut.cz...
> > Hello,
> >
> > can be these caps reason for my PC instability? Even on 1.85V is my
> > Duron
> > 1300 producing faults at Prime95...
> >
> > http://www.volny.cz/smatt/caps/
> >
> > MB is Abit KT7, VIA KT133.
> >
> > Thanks
> > Zdenek Sojka
> >
> >
>
>
> How old is the Abit motherboard (from when you bought it)?  Abit got hit
> by a class action lawsuit to make them replace bad caps.  They were the
> only one to openly announce that some of their motherboards had bad
> caps.  MANY other mobo makers had these bad caps but they denied the
> problem.  It was a case of espionage gone bad as only half the formula
> got stolen.  They extended the 1-year warranty to 3 years.  A couple
> months ago they got slapped with a class action lawsuit to force them
> what they already volunteered to do (except, I believe, they now have to
> pay for return shipping).  See
> http://www.pcstats.com/NewsView.cfm?NewsID=40744 and
> http://snipurl.com/ggroups_abit_caps.  For opening up about the problem
> and graciously helping their customers, their reward was to get slapped
> in the face.  But they don't do that again and instead will let follow
> the lead from the other mobo makers: screw the customers that sue even
> when you go beyond what all other mobo makers are doing.  Obviously if
> you send them a mobo that does not have bad capacitors means they will
> return the motherboard and charge you for shipping (both ways) because
> you wasted their time for non-warranty service.
>
> So what makes you believe the electryolytic capacitors are at fault?
> You could use an oscilloscope to look at the voltage levels and also
> check for the amount of ripple on each voltage line across the caps.  If
> the caps aren't bulging (on the normally flat top) or leaking out (which
> looks like a black stain) then my guess is that you read something and
> incorrectly associate that problem with whatever is your problem.
>
> Is you PC unstable when it just sits there after the POST but you do NOT
> load Windows (or any other operating system)?  Is it unstable when you
> use a bootable floppy to go into MS-DOS?  Is it unstable when you boot
> into Recovery Console mode?  Is it unstable if you boot using a bootable
> CD that loads a different operating system?  And just WHAT do you mean
> by unstable?  Hell, that could be because you used an underpowered power
> supply, or got a cheapie that can't manage to put out more than 75% of
> its bogus rated output, or you have added lots more drives and other
> internal devices and simply loaded the power supply beyond the original
> configuration for the box.  Maybe you have a virus, like the one that
> forces a shutdown.  Maybe you installed software that is generating a
> BSOD (blue screen of death).  Maybe you installed a crappy device driver
> or the wrong one (i.e., not for the operating system that you use).
>
> Saying it is unstable is like going to the car shop and saying, "It's
> broke."  Extremely vague.

"Zdenek Sojka" <xXzsoXjkaXx.***@seXznamX.cz> wrote in message
news:d1kigi$24rr$1@ns.felk.cvut.cz...
>
> "Vanguard" <use_ReplyTo_header> píse v diskusním príspevku
> news:1t-dnX_-a9DuAaDfRVn-pw@comcast.com...
>> "Zdenek Sojka" <xXzsoXjkaXx.***@seXznamX.cz> wrote in message
>> news:d1js6h$1q0u$1@ns.felk.cvut.cz...
>> > Hello,
>> >
>> > can be these caps reason for my PC instability? Even on 1.85V is my
>> > Duron
>> > 1300 producing faults at Prime95...
>> >
>> > http://www.volny.cz/smatt/caps/
>> >
>> > MB is Abit KT7, VIA KT133.
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> > Zdenek Sojka
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> How old is the Abit motherboard (from when you bought it)?  Abit got
>> hit
>> by a class action lawsuit to make them replace bad caps.  They were
>> the
>> only one to openly announce that some of their motherboards had bad
>> caps.  MANY other mobo makers had these bad caps but they denied the
>> problem.  It was a case of espionage gone bad as only half the
>> formula
>> got stolen.  They extended the 1-year warranty to 3 years.  A couple
>> months ago they got slapped with a class action lawsuit to force them
>> what they already volunteered to do (except, I believe, they now have
>> to
>> pay for return shipping).  See
>> http://www.pcstats.com/NewsView.cfm?NewsID=40744 and
>> http://snipurl.com/ggroups_abit_caps.  For opening up about the
>> problem
>> and graciously helping their customers, their reward was to get
>> slapped
>> in the face.  But they don't do that again and instead will let
>> follow
>> the lead from the other mobo makers: screw the customers that sue
>> even
>> when you go beyond what all other mobo makers are doing.  Obviously
>> if
>> you send them a mobo that does not have bad capacitors means they
>> will
>> return the motherboard and charge you for shipping (both ways)
>> because
>> you wasted their time for non-warranty service.
>>
>> So what makes you believe the electryolytic capacitors are at fault?
>> You could use an oscilloscope to look at the voltage levels and also
>> check for the amount of ripple on each voltage line across the caps.
>> If
>> the caps aren't bulging (on the normally flat top) or leaking out
>> (which
>> looks like a black stain) then my guess is that you read something
>> and
>> incorrectly associate that problem with whatever is your problem.
>>
>> Is you PC unstable when it just sits there after the POST but you do
>> NOT
>> load Windows (or any other operating system)?  Is it unstable when
>> you
>> use a bootable floppy to go into MS-DOS?  Is it unstable when you
>> boot
>> into Recovery Console mode?  Is it unstable if you boot using a
>> bootable
>> CD that loads a different operating system?  And just WHAT do you
>> mean
>> by unstable?  Hell, that could be because you used an underpowered
>> power
>> supply, or got a cheapie that can't manage to put out more than 75%
>> of
>> its bogus rated output, or you have added lots more drives and other
>> internal devices and simply loaded the power supply beyond the
>> original
>> configuration for the box.  Maybe you have a virus, like the one that
>> forces a shutdown.  Maybe you installed software that is generating a
>> BSOD (blue screen of death).  Maybe you installed a crappy device
>> driver
>> or the wrong one (i.e., not for the operating system that you use).
>>
>> Saying it is unstable is like going to the car shop and saying, "It's
>> broke."  Extremely vague.
>
> I didn't say 'Its unstable', I exactly said 'Even on 1.85V is my Duron
> 1300 producing faults at Prime95...' - it is not overheating, at most
> 70C
> (at this voltage).
> The PSU is a 400W Fortron.
> I think, there should be seen at
> http://www.volny.cz/smatt/caps/P3180010.JPG
> how bad it is...
> Well , the MB is some 7 zears old, but I have some 486 working for
> over 15
> years...
>
> Zdenek Sojka
>
>

>
>Did you run it under a clean install of whatever operating system you
>use that Prime95 supports, or are you running it on your production host
>that has a myriad of programs, services, and other stuff running
>concurrently?  Could be you are running something or a suite of
>processes that causes interference or conflicts.
>
>Are you overclocking any components, like upping the clock for the
>memory?  Did you tweak any of the BIOS settings to the memory, or did
>you configure it to use SPD (serial presence detect) to run at the
>settings that the memory reports for it?
>
>From the photos in your URL link, it is hard to tell if some of the
>electrolytics are bulging on the top or if it just the angle of the
>light and the reflection off their metal tops.  From the photos, it
>looks like some are bulging.  Doesn't look like there is any leakage,
>though.  They do look like the green ones that I've heard about that
>went bad.
>
>It's too late to enter the class action lawsuit noted in the link in my
>other post (and at http://www.abitsettlement.com/). 

>"kony" <spam@spam.com> wrote in message
>news:5h3s311lie750esrrjefu90ig4ubcqh2a9@4ax.com...
>
>>>I like Fortron PSUs since
>>>they usually under-rate the power output available; however, for the
>>>variable-speed fans, they need a better provider.
>>
>> On which models?
>
>On the Aurora model which uses a fan that I only remember had a brand
>name starting with "Y" (maybe Y S Tech although I thought it was a
>one-word brand name).  In some of those models, I've had to replace the
>"Y" fan in about 3 months because it started to make noise.  Not super
>loud like most fans when their bearings get worn or get out of balance
>from wear around the pin shaft.  Oiling it didn't help.  It would be
>loudest when cold and get quieter after it warmed up many minutes later.
>It was loud enough in a very quiet office to be irritating even when
>setting the potentiometer for a fan speed at its slowest setting (the
>PSU will still up the speed based on temperature beyond what user sets
>using the pot).  I believe they discontinued the FSP350-60PN Aurora
>model because of problems with the potentiometer and the PCB to which it
>connects.
>
>You can see a pic of its guts at
>http://www.silentpcreview.com/article106-page2.html.  It shows a clear
>fan but mine was opaque black (and no blue LED, either, as I couldn't
>give a gnat's fart about a blue hue inside my opaque case).  I haven't
>had a problem with the units with the clear fans (2 of them), only with
>the ones that had the black fans (3 of them).  It was easy enough to
>open the PSU to replace the 120mm fan (but I recall having to watch its
>thickness to make sure it was skinny enough to fit).

>
>> Many of them use NMB, maybe a few Nidecs... premium fans
>> bested by no others.  I do note that sometimes the fan speed
>> seems optimized more towards good cooling rather than lowest
>> noise, but on the other hand I have a Fortron 460W that is
>> among the quiestest PSU I've ever had, per "X" load on it,
>> as shipped/stock configuration.
>>
>> On the other hand, some models have Yate Loon fans- low end
>> crap with so-so sleeve bearing.
>
>Yeah, that was the brand.  Yates Loon.  I don't know about the quality
>of that brand because I never buy that brand.  It seemed a bit chintzy
>in quality to be used in a Fortron PSU.

"kony" <spam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:kgou315atrurl1qiqopbm710cbdabq6c32@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 02:03:16 -0600, "Vanguard"

>>UPDATE:  While writing this, I just found the Panaflow FBA08A24L1A at
>>digikey.com for $8.25.

> LOL, we must be thinking on the same wavelength today...
> I'd mentioned the Panaflo before reading the whole post and
> then went to Digikey before seeing what you wrote.
>
> Well for the benefit of others I'll link it while on my
> clipboard,
>
> http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?PName?Name=P9739-ND

>>Don't know why I didn't look there before.  Sure
>>beats the $25 that I paid for the industrial quality but noisy
>>replacement that I used before.  I just can't tell, however, if this
>>is
>>a 3-wire fan from its specs (at
>>http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/appliance/pdf/fba08a.pdf) which
>>say
>>the third wire is optional.

> I don't think it does have the 3rd lead but i could be
> wrong.  Even so, if it  has RPM lead but you need rotor lock
> then there's another variable too.  Rotor lock does seem to
> be more common feature on 24V fans and equipment that only
> needs to know if fan stops, not it's actual RPM... but for
> your purpose I wouldn't hazzard a guess.

>> I don't think it does have the 3rd lead but i could be
>> wrong.  Even so, if it  has RPM lead but you need rotor lock
>> then there's another variable too.  Rotor lock does seem to
>> be more common feature on 24V fans and equipment that only
>> needs to know if fan stops, not it's actual RPM... but for
>> your purpose I wouldn't hazzard a guess.
>
>I would suspect that the UPS wants a 24-volt 80cm fan that uses rotor
>lock instead of RPM.  This UPS doesn't show the fan's RPM when using its
>front LED panel and there is no RPM metering shown in the NT service and
>control panel applet for the UPS.  The spec for the Panasonic Panaflow
>says, "Optional third lead wire signal (Locked rotor alarm sensor,
>2PPR)" so it looks like it should work - if the fan actually includes
>the "optional" feature.  The photo in the PDF doc shows a 3-pin header
>yet the dimensions diagram shows a 2-wire pair pre-attached to the
>housing.  So I'll probably have to call them to ensure they give me the
>3-wire version (so it has the rotor lock sense).